The musicians of the Budapest Festival Orchestra always look forward with great anticipation to having Jukka-Pekka Saraste conducting them. In late April, they will together perform a piece played relatively rarely: Bruckner’s Symphony No. 8, which experts say is a thoroughly difficult piece to bring to life, but is also absolutely magnificent and uniquely exciting. We asked the Finnish conductor to talk about the tense dualities of the piece, overcoming lifelong loneliness, and the secrets of Symphony No. 8. Interview.
What are you doing to prepare for your concert in Budapest?
Jukka-Pekka Saraste: I have conducted this symphony by Bruckner several times, and I have even produced an audio recording of it with the WDR Symphony Orchestra. So for this concert, I really just had to refresh my previous experiences. It’s true that the structure of the piece is highly complex, and when you are getting ready, you have to think over and over again about what the composer wanted to say through this music.
Can you describe what he had in mind when he was composing this piece, the last symphony he completed?
J-P S.: Perhaps the most important characteristic of Bruckner’s musical expression is the duality incorporating modesty and strength. It is likely that these two fundamental characteristics were true of his personality as well. He is at times very reserved and modest, while at other times being the exact opposite: very much determined and strong, in a way evocative of Beethoven. I am particularly fascinated by this duality (or self-contradiction, if you will), within the same character. This is what makes Symphony No. 8 so exciting; but this also holds true for Nos. 5 and 6. The latter is perhaps the one I have most often conducted. But he also has symphonies which are almost “Wagnerian”, like Nos. 4 and 7, which are in a way more romantic, and do not involve much conflict.
What can you tell us about the story of the creation of Symphony No. 8? What role did the fact that Bruckner dedicated it to Emperor Franz Joseph play in its turning out so special?
J-P S.: I don’t know that the way he composed for the emperor was any different than otherwise, but if we look at the content, we do find a number of interesting things. Let’s start with the first part: its rhythmic form matches Beethoven’s Symphony No. 9 perfectly. In the first movement, he makes it clear that he considers Beethoven the king of the symphony, and someone he wishes to emulate. In the following movements, he takes a different approach, establishing the ideal form of the symphony genre. Certainly, you can still detect the impact of Beethoven here, including in the notion that there is first some kind of conflict, which he then gradually resolves through the ingenious entrances of the various instruments. We may consider this symphony a long journey in the forest of emotions. It is filled with various characters, and when you encounter these, you arrive at the solution, where tension is released and relief is attained.
According to the musicians, Symphony No. 8 is filled with drama, worry and fear. Would you agree, as the conductor?
J-P S.: Yes, that is in fact true. And this is why it is so close to me. As I said, it leads you through a cavalcade of the most extreme emotions, crossing the most unforgiving landscape, to ultimately arrive at release and the land of calm. I feel I can identify with this approach very much; there is something of this duality in my own personality. Perhaps it is no coincidence that I often conduct Mahler, whose pieces involve a great deal of similarity in that regard. He takes a different approach to presenting this contradictory character, but the essence is often the same. When I first encountered this symphony by Bruckner, I was very excited by its first version. I thought it was extraordinarily modern and innovative, and I did not understand why Bruckner’s friends would have dissuaded him from completing the piece in the same style. But they convinced him to write a new version. With this, they actually wanted to transform Bruckner’s personality, which was in part reflected in the second version. Ultimately, it is the first version, transformed by Leopold Nowak, which has become most accepted, and which has managed to preserve its originality and uniqueness. This is the version I like the most, but all three are enjoyable. We will be performing the second version with the Festival Orchestra, and I know it will be a beautiful performance, because the BFO’s musicians are highly skilled at interpreting even the most complex elements.
You said this symphony is the one most closely matching your personality. What exactly do you mean by that?
J-P S.: I’ll try to explain. I have always thought, and perhaps this is more valid today than it ever has been, that the most important role music can play in our lives is to help us recognise and understand the complexity of the world. If it manages to touch you, music can be used to resolve the sense of loneliness which accompanies you your entire life. For me, Bruckner has always been a great help in this. However, his fate is not at all similar to mine, since his life was defined by his religiousness and his close connection to Catholicism. I am far from that; his approach to humanity, however, was just as important an element of his life as it is of mine.
Bruckner’s Symphony No. 8 will be performed on 28, 29 and 30 April at Müpa Budapest.
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